- Aaron
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AaronCorcorran |
Nautilus Bulletins |
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Posts: 48 (26-Mar-10 15:49:11) |
Does anyone have the complete set of these? John Wood is now selling reproductions of the complete sets. Mine are on order.
- Aaron |
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grffn |
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Posts: 609 (26-Mar-10 18:47:01) Moderator |
I have all three of them. Great stuff. Well worth it. Straight from Jones' mouth,his theories are a little different than alot of people interpreted them
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J Duggan |
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Posts: 535 (29-Mar-10 11:19:36) Moderator |
You're gonna enjoy them. Somehow, somewhere, Jones' theories kind of fell out of favor with the mainstream population of trainers and trainees. What a shame---the man was way ahead of his time. He certainly had his peculiarities, as all of us do, and he definitely did some strange things, but his theories about exercise were sound.
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grffn |
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Posts: 609 (29-Mar-10 15:24:09) Moderator |
most don't WANT to believe that Jones' theories and abbreiviated training works. Gotta keep the high volume, mainstream garbage alive.
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Natch.theanvil88051 |
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Posts: 79 (29-Mar-10 16:12:09) |
It all comes down to $$$. People are lazy, and don't want to spend the time to find out for themselves how to train. They would rather spend upwards of $100/hr to some so-called "Personal Trainer", to count reps for them and to tell them what to do. The main stream personal trainer has to make the work-out last longer because they are paid by the hour, not by the results. Even people who use the "expetese" of the rep counter at the gym, depend on the latest bunch of "information" from this months poser mags. I have given up on trying to explain to people about basic multi-joint movements done at a high level of intenisty. I tell them that you can work out "hard" or you can work out "long", but you can't work out hard for long....and they look at me as if I had three heads, and then they want to know why the are not getting stronger
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AaronCorcorran |
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Posts: 48 (29-Mar-10 17:33:44) |
I've come across sections of his bulletins before. I was on the PDA email mailing list before the the owner died and he would regularly send out scanned reprints. So far everything I've read of Jones theories have re-enforced my own hard fought ideas about training and recovery. I have little tolerence for Gym rats or personal trainers in general either. But I am in the process of re-educating a couple of open minded personal trainers here thru my weekly group training sessions at the house. Its always fun to see someones eyes opened to how much BS they had swallowed without a second thought. My copies of the reprinted Bulletin 1 and 2 have now come in and I'm looking forward to a good read.
- Aaron |
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grffn |
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Posts: 609 (29-Mar-10 18:01:48) Moderator |
Aaron alot of the stuff in the bulletins wont be new to you but you'll still love em. What I thought was interesting is how his ideas evolved. What Darden and Mentzer were saying was quite a bit different than what Jones' original ideas were. Not completely,but enough so that the original bulletins are worth having and reading. Like Jim was saying his teachings have faded a little,only because most people refuse to train as hard as Jones(Max Bob,Dr. Ken,etc. for that matter) want them too. So the best way to not have to do it is to convince yourself that it doesn't work. In my 25+ years going to gyms I have seen one trainer have any kind of success with their clients, he used a one set to failure approach with very slow rep cadence.
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AaronCorcorran |
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Posts: 48 (29-Mar-10 18:11:26) |
My biggest increases in strength and size occurred just out of college doing a 1 set to failure / full body / once every week to 10 days. So I highly agree with that. Have any of you guys read Static Contraction training by Pete Sisco and John Little? From what I remember Mentzer contributed some of the ideas of the method and felt it was an evolution in training methodology. I've used the principles in some of my grip training with good success as well.
- Aaron |
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AaronCorcorran |
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Posts: 48 (29-Mar-10 18:20:55) |
Actually I may be mixing up the book that Mentzer contributed too. Come to think of it I think it may have been Max Contraction Training by John Little. Very similiar content to Static Contraction book but slightly different approach. Also John Little was co-author on the Static Contr. book as well.
Thanks, Aaron |
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grffn |
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Posts: 609 (30-Mar-10 15:36:15) Moderator |
I have read a little about Static contraction training. Its getting popular now. Have never tried it so I can't make a judgement. I've never been a big partial rep guy either. I don't see how holding a heavy weight will transfer over to being able to move a heavy weight thru the full range of motion,which is ultimately the goal right? Ideally you want to use static contractions with huge weights then move back to conventional weight lifting and be able to move much more weight than before. Can't see it happening really. But these guys are thinkers and smart,and are in the abbreiviated training way of thinking so its worth looking into
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AaronCorcorran |
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Posts: 48 (30-Mar-10 17:27:39) |
There is some interesting science behind it. To summarize your muscles are made up of many motor units. Some are fast twitch, some slow, etc. What determines the tension of a muscle is how many are turned on (Also other factors contribute due to training related adaptations but lets keep it simple). so you move by activating varying numbers of motor units as necessary. slow twitch first (type I), followed by fast twitch endurance type (type IIA) followed by fast twitch power (type IIB). Each motor unit is all of one type btw. You get stronger thru adaptation correct? in order to adapt you must stress the motor unit to the point that generates an adaptation response but not so far that it cant recover in the recovery time you give it. Typical training doesnt give enough intensity to bring in all the motor units at once. ie as MU fatigue doing reps others of a higher cost are brought online and muscles are only fully contracted or maximally taxed for a brief instant during the cycle of a rep which contributes to the reduction in consistent maximal intensity time under tension. by using this method you have a targeted approach to bring the maximum number of motor units to full tension for only the required time to necessitate adaptation (strength improvement / growth) and no more. Followed by enough rest to recover and grow stronger before the next attack. Thats a nutshell of how I think of it anyway. The author of Max Contraction (John Little) also a co-author on Static contraction training collaborated quite a bit with Mentzer in his later years as a side note.
- Aaron |
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grffn |
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Posts: 609 (30-Mar-10 18:36:39) Moderator |
I know that Sisco says why fool around with a weight in parts of the range of motion that your weak. Get in your strongest position and hold the heaviest weight you can for 5 seconds (I think). I know thats a very simple explanation but thats the main point I think. I have read some of his stuff and it is interesting,and not your mainstream bodybuilding garbage thats for sure. John Little took over for Mentzer in Iron Man's Heavy Duty column when he passsed away.
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AaronCorcorran |
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Posts: 48 (30-Mar-10 19:27:51) |
I think John Little's approach may be the better of the 2 but tougher to implement with standard equipment. Similiar to the heaviest weight idea but instead of just the general strongest position idea he is shooting for that contraction at the full muscle contraction position. So for Biceps it would be at the top of a curl, for quads would be straight leg, etc. Both books are good reads although they can read like ad material at times. Did not know that about Little taking over Mentzer column.
- Aaron |
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manning |
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Posts: 119 ( 1-Apr-10 11:43:16) |
hi Aaron,did i read you correctly when you said you trained once a week on a full body program? if so thats interesting because thats what im doing at the moment,im getting older and need the recovery time.but it makes you wonder if someone like yourself makes some of their best gains training this way at such a young age.maybe ive always trained to much,lol,,, im making good progress at the moment in most excercises struggling with the clean and press,and that used to be one of my best lifts,,lol,any tips would be usefull, and welcome to the board,,
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AaronCorcorran |
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Posts: 48 ( 1-Apr-10 12:42:51) |
manning,
Yes I did that at one point for about 6 months before my back injury ended my lifting for the next 9 years. I ruptured the disc helping someone move not training btw. I had awesome results on it and it was something I came up with on my own after about 12 years of lifting. I would train every 7-10 days full body one heavy set of 6-10reps per exercise. would change the exercises every 6 weeks or so. I was typically adding 1-2 reps per exercise per workout and whenever I would get 10 reps I would up the weight to put me back around 6 reps. as far as the determining factor of when to train, I would wait a couple of days after the soreness subsided before training and that would end up being 7-10 days for me. Over the years I've had a few other guys try it with similiar results. I truly believe that most people don't provide enough recovery time to fully overcompensate for the training they do. That and that most do too many sets of fluff and not enough tough meat and potatoes work. Those workouts typically took 25 minutes or so a week for me. Now as far as Clean and press, cleans can be a somewhat technical lift. If your form is off, or your flexibility, etc it can make a huge difference. I started doing cleans at 14 and didnt really start dialing in my form until I was about 21 or 22. I can't do them worth a darn anymore. lack of flexibility in the right places, the back injury and left wrist pain from a bad rack with 405 in 96' make even 135 painful and ugly for me now. Now all that being said if your trying to develop more explosive capabilities and your clean pull have you tried heavy high pulls? They might help. If its something else, let me know. - Aaron |
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manning |
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Posts: 119 ( 1-Apr-10 16:06:51) |
Aaron thanks for replying, i just dont seem to be able to increase the strenth in the press part of the lift,i clean because i train at home so need to get the bar up to press.all my other exercises are going well apart from this,maybe i can only perform one exercise on each type of movement,one press, one pull,one leg movement etc,truble is i like to try and make the routine as rounded as possible.
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AaronCorcorran |
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Posts: 48 ( 1-Apr-10 17:22:04) |
Ahh, ok. where is the problem on your press? lockout? midrange? where in your training session are you doing it? first, middle, end? It might be something as simple as a shoulder flexibility issue impeding the tracking of the bar. Have you ever tried Overhead squats? I find those are pretty good indicators of my shoulder flexibility on the press. If I can't squat down even with a lightish weight overhead then my shoulders are usually too tight. you might try that and see how it goes.
- Aaron |
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manning |
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Posts: 119 ( 2-Apr-10 13:33:51) |
yes it is at the beginning of the lift pain in the shoulder at the start of the press,, i do the presses at the end of the workout in rest pause style ,most of the time,tried the squat,, ha useless,lol thanks
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AaronCorcorran |
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Posts: 48 (13-May-10 17:56:11) |
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grffn |
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Posts: 609 (13-May-10 19:58:43) Moderator |
Aaron do you have all the Hardgainer mags. Steel Tip,Hard Training Newsletters,also. If you like the Bulletins you'll love those publications
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AaronCorcorran |
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Posts: 48 (14-May-10 11:43:40) |
grffn wrote: I don't actually have any subject related magazines. I think I may have bought a bodybuilding mag once in my teens, saw it was crap and tossed it. However I do have the updated reprint collection of the Steel Tip and this will be all of the Nautilus bulletins. Mostly what I have though is subject related books. I have a couple of shelves in my bookcase devoted to strength related books. Such as Dinosaur Training, Rock Iron Steel, Science and practice of Strength Training, etc.. Some more technically involved than others but I find that I often have Eureka moments reading about a subject where I can extrapolate or make connections from ideas presented that I actually had not thought of yet even though what is on the page is something I already knew. Its great when a training method works for you after you stumble upon it, but its even cooler when you understand why it works. - Aaron |
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